Old boxer
Question:
Quintin, I don’t know if this information will be much help but for what it worth I’ll share it with you: Today on Animal Planet’s "Pet Story" there was a profile done on a dog named "Chester" (the segment was #184 titled:"Bootleg Chester"). Five months after being hit by a car, Chester was still struggling with nerve damage to her hind leg. Her owners took her to University Of Pennsylvania’s Animal Hospital where vets there said Chester had damage to her Sciatic (sp?) nerve which runs right down the dogs leg and controls the way the animal puts the leg and paw down. *You mentioned something about your dog dragging ("knuckling") his paw didn’t you? Anyway, the owners had already tried "boots" to try and make the dog walk right but they were no longer affective. Vets at the Univ.of Penn.Animal Hospital have designed a new high-tech orthotic boot made right at the Animal Hospital. Here is how it works: Robert Sigafoos (who is a farrier by trade) designed a brace that allows the dog to put his foot dog in a normal position. He does this by first making a plaster of paris cast on the dogs leg; next: he takes that cast off and uses it to make a mold out of polyethaline/polydurathane with a rubber grip added to the end for traction. So, the dog then wears this custom made brace/boot from then on and it seems very successful. Here is a link with more information: http://animal.discovery.com/schedule/episode.jsp?episode=682279022
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Quintin, >I don’t know if this information will be much help but for what it worth I’ll >share it with you: >Today on Animal Planet’s "Pet Story" there was a profile done on a dog named >"Chester" (the segment was #184 titled:"Bootleg Chester"). >Five months after being hit by a car, Chester was still struggling with nerve >damage to her hind leg. >Her owners took her to University Of Pennsylvania’s Animal Hospital where vets >there said Chester had damage to her Sciatic (sp?) nerve which runs right down >the dogs leg and controls the way the animal puts the leg and paw down. >*You mentioned something about your dog dragging ("knuckling") his paw didn’t >you? >Anyway, the owners had already tried "boots" to try and make the dog walk right >but they were no longer affective. >Vets at the Univ.of Penn.Animal Hospital have designed a new high-tech orthotic >boot made right at the Animal Hospital. >Here is how it works: >Robert Sigafoos (who is a farrier by trade) designed a brace that allows the >dog to put his foot dog in a normal position. >He does this by first making a plaster of paris cast on the dogs leg; >next: he takes that cast off and uses it to make a mold out of >polyethaline/polydurathane with a rubber grip added to the end for traction. >So, the dog then wears this custom made brace/boot from then on and it seems >very successful. Here is a link with more information: >http://animal.discovery.com/schedule/episode.jsp?episode=682279022 >Hi KP,
Thanks for posting this info. According to the listing on Discovery, the show should run, again, on June 19th at 3pm. Have to check the Tivo. The U.of Pa. has an artical on the orthotic boot. I would have sent the URL, but, I don’t know how. I am very much interested. Phyll – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Response:
Thank you KauilaPolu, for your wise words. Over and over, I keep trying to remind myself of this, but I’m a phone and data network troubleshooter, and a good one at that, and given enough time I can always fix the problem or at least find out what’s causing it. But with my dear buddyboy I feel so helpless. I keep wondering why the doctors can’t do their job like I do mine. And this is soooo much more important than any network. I know the body is a different kind of subject, but that just doesn’t seem to sink into my skull. Yes, it sure does suck. The battle of time takes no prisoners. Quintin – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Q" > Getting old sucks. Little by little life comes down to a handful of things that > are left…simple things…things others might not see at all, but things that > still warm a heart or make the spirit faintly glow. > Sometimes it all comes down to the fact that for one more day we can still see > the sunset again snuggled up against a kindred spirit…a loving heart. > Sometimes we can’t fix everything. That hurts when the things you want to fix > are for the one who has given SO much of themself for you. So…instead of > finding that next miracle or cure, we accept the options and shine-up those > waning days with all the compassion and dedication we can muster. Sometimes > that HAS to be enough.
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>That lasted until they found out the incontinence was going to be a >given.
For the last years of my yorki’s life I used regular (cheap) pampers on him. They were a life-saver. I just cut an "X" on the end without the tabs (for his tail) and for a few cents a diaper I could forget about it ALL. Still…everyone who saw him in diapers made a face or a comment. I on the otherhand was proud I found a cheap, do-able solution to a problem that was not going to get better.
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. >Actually this wasn’t entirely off-topic at all. How many TIMES have I heard >"Well, maybe it’s "time"…right here on this board. >You have no idea how many times I’ve already heard (from my own family >members)…how wasteful and silly it was for me to spend so much money on my 14 >yr. old Chihauhau recently when I paid for surgery to fix a ruptured cruciate >ligament and a grade 4 luxated patella (knee).
When I approached my husband and kids about taking this dog, they were all supportive and all swore they would help with anything necessary. That lasted until they found out the incontinence was going to be a given. I didn’t mind, as it was easier to clean up behind the dog, than chance their gagging may actually produce something. Some family and friends think I am nuts but they had that opinion long before the dog came along. The fact that so many vets would opt for putting him down was hard to swallow. I’m just one person with one dog and I didn’t get any encouragement from the medical field. Those are sad statistics. I think, now, they realize it’s doable. I’ve seen people and their pets suffer the effects of illness, and it can be heart-breaking. I have not had this with Tiger, He is paralysed, period. >In fact, right now I live my with grown daughter and she and her husband just >shake their head when they see that Scrappy still isn’t bouncing around like a >puppy yet (it’s only been 3 weeks) and DESPITE my telling them "Look, he’s had >his KNEE rebuilt…it takes TIME!"..what did they say? "We’ll see!"
Your love for, and faith in, Scrappy’s recovery is the best medicine. Good luck with him. >From now on should I DARE mention a need to watch my money or deny myself >something while I recovery from this expense…I will guarantee you that MORE >than a few people will be saying to themselves and each other "Well…I for one >don’t feel sorry for her. She COULD be $800 richer right now…IF only…"
I would keep a list of anything, unnecessarily, purchased by them, just in case I needed proof that we all have different priorites. But, that’s me, and I openly admit… I’m nuts. >Yeah…if only. If only I didn’t decide to put a faithful friend at the top of >my priority list. If only I didn’t say to myself more and more these days "The >more I know about PEOPLE…the more I love my DOGS!"
Perhaps when you’re over this ordeal with Scrappy, you’ll feel better. I wish that for you. Phyll – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Response:
yeah, I got crap from people for fixing both my dog’s ACLs too. stuff like "you spent all that money on a *dog*?" …. psheesh! … definitely a priority thing Q
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Thanks to all out there who have read this off-topic post. >It’s almost like having someone listening to me. > Actually this wasn’t entirely off-topic at all. How many TIMES have I heard > "Well, maybe it’s "time"…right here on this board. > You have no idea how many times I’ve already heard (from my own family > members)…how wasteful and silly it was for me to spend so much money on my 14 > yr. old Chihauhau recently when I paid for surgery to fix a ruptured cruciate > ligament and a grade 4 luxated patella (knee). > In fact, right now I live my with grown daughter and she and her husband just > shake their head when they see that Scrappy still isn’t bouncing around like a > puppy yet (it’s only been 3 weeks) and DESPITE my telling them "Look, he’s had > his KNEE rebuilt…it takes TIME!"..what did they say? "We’ll see!" > From now on should I DARE mention a need to watch my money or deny myself > something while I recovery from this expense…I will guarantee you that MORE > than a few people will be saying to themselves and each other "Well…I for one > don’t feel sorry for her. She COULD be $800 richer right now…IF only…" > Yeah…if only. If only I didn’t decide to put a faithful friend at the top of > my priority list. If only I didn’t say to myself more and more these days "The > more I know about PEOPLE…the more I love my DOGS!" > No. This is ON topic here.
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>Thanks to all out there who have read this off-topic post. >It’s almost like having someone listening to me.
Actually this wasn’t entirely off-topic at all. How many TIMES have I heard "Well, maybe it’s "time"…right here on this board. You have no idea how many times I’ve already heard (from my own family members)…how wasteful and silly it was for me to spend so much money on my 14 yr. old Chihauhau recently when I paid for surgery to fix a ruptured cruciate ligament and a grade 4 luxated patella (knee). In fact, right now I live my with grown daughter and she and her husband just shake their head when they see that Scrappy still isn’t bouncing around like a puppy yet (it’s only been 3 weeks) and DESPITE my telling them "Look, he’s had his KNEE rebuilt…it takes TIME!"..what did they say? "We’ll see!" From now on should I DARE mention a need to watch my money or deny myself something while I recovery from this expense…I will guarantee you that MORE than a few people will be saying to themselves and each other "Well…I for one don’t feel sorry for her. She COULD be $800 richer right now…IF only…" Yeah…if only. If only I didn’t decide to put a faithful friend at the top of my priority list. If only I didn’t say to myself more and more these days "The more I know about PEOPLE…the more I love my DOGS!" No. This is ON topic here.
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>Hell, quality of life?? Look at the ‘quality of life’ poor people have (or >don’t have) or OLD people…sitting alone in a ‘home’ or waiting for visits >that never come or rides to the store just to buy food or just help with things >that old age won’t allow their body to do for them anymore.
So true!!! This also works in reverse. In Feb., my 98 year old Mom was in and out of the hospital with bronchitis. She contracted c-diff, an antibiotic related infection. The doctor ordered discharge, twice, without even checking her records, and was ticked at me for asking the results of blood work the first time and x-ray results the second. His attitude was…she’s 98, what do you expect? I did suggest he may be better suited to a job at the city morgue where the patient’s condition is not likely to deviate from ’stable’. I had to fight family members for my Mom’s right to make her own decisions about her life. All she wanted to do was go home and get better so she could take care of her boyfriend ( he’s 83 ).<g> In March the visiting nurse mentioned the need for hospice, on 3 different occasions. I thought I must be in denial, so I went along with that. When the nurse came to evaluate her, she asked my Mom’s wishes and asked if she thought the time was near. Her reply, verbatim," I don’t know when the Good Lord will call me, but, I know it won’t be today". As of this past Monday, hospice has deemed her too fit for their services. Ed, her friend, is enjoying home-cooked meals, and she is enjoying taking care of her man. So, you are right about: >Quality of life…as long as SOMEBODY loves you then I say you HAVE quality of >life. As long as SOMEBODY wants you to live forever…DESPITE the shape your >in, then I say you HAVE quality of life. >Maybe it has no measure to an outsider but isn’t it just a shame that a doctor >can’t imagine ONE reason to try and improve life where he can EVEN for a >creature on the far end of life…or even when a year can’t be quaranteed…why >can’t a DOCTOR imagine that a DAY of hope IS quality of life to SOMEONE?
Hospital personnel saw a 98 year old with nothing to live for. They didn’t know that before she got sick she took care of two of her neighbors, one with Alzheimer’s and a heart condition, the other, blind and bed-ridden. >I feel better now.
And so do I. Sorry for the rant! I believe in the squeaky wheel getting the grease. Even if you have to rant sometimes. >The way I see it is that it’s YOUR call. It’s YOUR quest and if you want to buy >a piece of that medical miracle (or just a bandaid at a time) then WHY NOT?
Amen. It’s quiet in my little corner of the world. No one is speaking to me. Thanks to all out there who have read this off-topic post. It’s almost like having someone listening to me. Phyll
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Phyll, Ironic isn’t it that ‘because’ euthanazia isn’t an option for people, those who must live their lives without the use of limbs, or must endure YEARS in bed with life-altering illness…those people are never told (to their face) that "Perhaps it’s ‘time’ to end things..due to a lack of quality of life!" Hell, quality of life?? Look at the ‘quality of life’ poor people have (or don’t have) or OLD people…sitting alone in a ‘home’ or waiting for visits that never come or rides to the store just to buy food or just help with things that old age won’t allow their body to do for them anymore. Quality of life…as long as SOMEBODY loves you then I say you HAVE quality of life. As long as SOMEBODY wants you to live forever…DESPITE the shape your in, then I say you HAVE quality of life. Maybe it has no measure to an outsider but isn’t it just a shame that a doctor can’t imagine ONE reason to try and improve life where he can EVEN for a creature on the far end of life…or even when a year can’t be quaranteed…why can’t a DOCTOR imagine that a DAY of hope IS quality of life to SOMEONE? I feel better now. Sorry for the rant! The way I see it is that it’s YOUR call. It’s YOUR quest and if you want to buy a piece of that medical miracle (or just a bandaid at a time) then WHY NOT?
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Since this is a teaching hospital your chances of getting help there are better than private practice. Also, this procedure has not been done all that much so call them or even email and include details about your dog’s condition. Usually when some new procedure is trying to take off the ground they are recruiting specific ‘types’ and in this case I remember the show mentioned that this dog "Chester"? was a good candidate for the boot. Good luck. Glad I could help.
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>Since this is a teaching hospital your chances of getting help there are better >than private practice. Also, this procedure has not been done all that much so >call them or even email and include details about your dog’s condition. Usually >when some new procedure is trying to take off the ground they are recruiting >specific ‘types’ and in this case I remember the show mentioned that this dog >"Chester"? was a good candidate for the boot. >Good luck. Glad I could help.
Making strides in this area, is good news to me. We have been to the U.of Pa. several times. The first was when I decided to keep him. Four years later he had a piece of bone removed from one leg. They were surprised he was still alive. Unfortunately, this has been the experience with the 4 other vets he’s had: 1. Questioned his quality of life. I point blank told her I had come for her medical,not personal opinion and not to charge me for that part. Time to move on. 2. Diagnosed a possible brain tumor, his body temp. was so low, she didn’t understand why he was still alive. That evening on Merv Griffin, a guest, with a paralysed dog, wearing a jacket, explained the need to keep warm due to ‘the low body temp’. Movin’ on, again. 3. Obviously uncomfortable with his need for clothing, again, the quality of life thing. 4. Enlarged heart, fluid on the lungs, incorrectly diagnosed. 5. Told him I had just about wiped out all the vets in the area and if he tells me to put the dog down, I’ll be movin’ on. He understands my belief that vets are human first and do form opinions and are prone to relying on them. He understands that any diagnosis will be questioned and second opinions sought, if necessary. He finds Tiger healthy with a zest for life and that’s all that matters. When Tiger was 10, I received a call from a vet at the U.of Pa. who was doing a paper on paralysis. He said, "I understand you used to have a paralysed dog". I said, " used to"? He said, " Are you telling me he’s still alive"? We chatted for a while and on asking about my experiences, I told him the hardest part of dealing with Tiger, was the lack of support in the medical field. I never heard from him again. So, yes I am glad they have come a long way. At 15, I will still consider anything that may benefit Tiger. I don’t know that he would be a candidate, at his age. He has his homemade boots, and wheels, which have sufficed for years and we are still, optimistically, open to any new ideas that come along. Thanks for letting me share. Phyll
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>>Tivo. The U.of Pa. has an artical on the orthotic boot. I would >have sent the URL, but, I don’t know how. >I am very much interested. >Phyll >http://www.vet.upenn.edu/comm/publications/bellwether/48/running_agai… >I didn’t find any article about that specific orthotic boot >http://www.vet.upenn.edu/NewBoltonCenter/Services.cfm
Hi KP, I think this is going to work. It was easy with your instructions. The article I read was from 2001, so, the show will not be on again tomorrow. I am looking for more info like…price. Thanks, again, Phyll
Response:
thank you KauilaPolu After all his tests they concluded that the most likely cause was vertebral bone growth causing the spinal canal to shrink — stenosis. The prednisone fixed his rear leg weakness by reducing tissue size and allowing the (smaller) spine and nerves to ‘fit’ in the reduced spinal canal with less pressure and therefore function more normally. His legs were much better but his appetite was absurdly! out of control. I’ll look into it and see if it might work on my buddy. Thanks again, I appreciate the lead. Just curious, is KauilaPolu Hawaiian?
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>Tivo. The U.of Pa. has an artical on the orthotic boot. I would >have sent the URL, but, I don’t know how. >I am very much interested. >Phyll
In order to copy a URL just "highlight" (click once until the address turns yellow or a color in your "keywords" box) …the place that shows "http://www….whatever"… next: ‘right click’ your mouse and click on COPY (you are copying the http://www.com address) and then start typing either your letter or your response anywhere else online. When it’s time to add your link just ‘right click’ your mouse again and this time click on PASTE. That’s all there is to it. I didn’t find any article about that specific orthotic boot on the Penn.UH site but I know it is done in the "Farrier Service Dept" and the link I’m including here has a phone number for the Vet.Hospital there so just ask for that dept. http://www.vet.upenn.edu/NewBoltonCenter/Services.cfm
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>Just curious, is KauilaPolu Hawaiian?
Yes it is. Means "Blue Lightning" ~
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"Q" Getting old sucks. Little by little life comes down to a handful of things that are left…simple things…things others might not see at all, but things that still warm a heart or make the spirit faintly glow. Sometimes it all comes down to the fact that for one more day we can still see the sunset again snuggled up against a kindred spirit…a loving heart. Sometimes we can’t fix everything. That hurts when the things you want to fix are for the one who has given SO much of themself for you. So…instead of finding that next miracle or cure, we accept the options and shine-up those waning days with all the compassion and dedication we can muster. Sometimes that HAS to be enough.
Response:
This happened to my 13 year old chow. He started having a lot of rear leg problems in his 13th year. He would limp a lot, but then he started to drag his rear foot as well as walk on his front foot bent or dragging that too. After awhile he was unable to get up. It was also impossible for him to climb stairs at this time. I did take him to the doctor, and she put him on some pills, but I believe when they are ready to go there is nothing more you can do. The body just gives out. I had to put the dog to sleep, as his paws started bleeding. There were also other symptoms it was time. He couldn’t control urinating in the house, even though he was in the yard all day, plus he started messing in the house. He also started to lose his appetite. He was a great dog. This was so unlike him, as he was a dog that always went to the bathroom in the same area of his own yard everyday. He was a very neat, clean dog. So, this had to be a case of just losing control; like elderly people do. Eventually, he would just lie down in one spot and not move all day. When he started to lose his appetite as well, I felt that his life had no pleasure any longer, so I had him put to sleep. I stayed with him while they put him down. It was very peaceful, he just closed his eyes; there was no twitching or pain. I am glad I stayed with him patting him and talking to him till the end.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Our old boxer is beginning to have difficulty controlling her hind legs. Has > anyone out there had to deal with this problem?
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Here’s my formless brain-dump My boy is currently going through it too. He’s an 80 lb lab/sheppard who turns fourteen Monday. It started two years ago. It may be old age or it may be from twisting his spine jumping out of a chair which paralyzed his rear legs for 12 hours. Anyway, that’s about the same time it started. He was dragging his rear knuckles causing them to bleed So I got him about 8 different brands of boots and found 2 that actually stayed on and worked. After about a year he didn’t need them anymore. He’s been getting worse again lately, it seems he’s better in cold weather. He developed ataxia (where the front and back legs aren’t in sync) about 6 or 8 months ago, and I noticed it gone on the last few walks. :) yey! If he stays ‘put’ for a long time he is stiff and limps for a few minutes. At the paralysis incident two years ago the vet said we should put him to death but I refused, and I’m glad I did. Later, I spent $3,000 on MRI, CT scan, X-rays, physical exam, urine and blood test, electromyelogram, and complete physical, and two trial runs of prednisone. Next, they wanted to do a biopsy of his nerves and I said "that’s enough, we’re done". They gave me half a dozen reasons why he could be having problems, but I kind of feel I wasted my money. The couldn’t fix him. At least the ruled out insulinoma, and a few other things. I just ended up with a very sore, groggy, shaved dog who still had weak rear legs. And it took him weeks to normalize after the prednisone (he was eating dirt, poop, … anything in sight … poor guy) If the cause was lime or something, I don’t know, maybe that’s curable. But for this old age degeneration thing, I believe the best thing for the dog is regular exercise to keep him going. Mine have gone 10 miles a week their whole life until about 2 years ago. Now it’s down to 2 – 4 miles / week. How old is your boxer? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Our old boxer is beginning to have difficulty controlling her hind legs. Has > anyone out there had to deal with this problem?
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Our old boxer is beginning to have difficulty controlling her hind legs. Has anyone out there had to deal with this problem?
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>Our old boxer is beginning to have difficulty controlling her hind legs.
Getting an accurate diagnosis would be your first step. Arthritis would be one of many common causes because your dog is older and it is the most common cause of problems in older pets but there are lots of causes of arthritis and the treatments vary some. There are other disorders that can lead to movement difficulties, such as spinal problems, hyperadrenocorticism, hypothyroidism, cruciate ligament injuries, bone cancer, heart disease and polymyositis. Arthritis can occur due to degenerative joint disease (the typical arthritis that people think of), from Lyme disease, from immune mediated disease, bacterial infections, systemic lupus erythematosus and other conditions. If a specific cause for the problems can be identified through examination, X-rays, aspiration from affected joints or other diagnostic tests, it is possible to tailor the treatment to the specific problem.
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